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 Post subject: United Kingdom/France Double Taxation Convention
PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2015 9:50 pm 
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Location: Was Plouasne 22830, now Ploeuc sur Lie 22150, France
This is the heading of the form, (its 17 pages long in total, in French and English)

United Kingdom/France Double Taxation Convention (SI 2009 Number 226)
APPLICATION for relief at source from United Kingdom income tax and
CLAIM to repayment of United Kingdom income tax

This form is for use by an individual resident of France receiving
a UK State Pension or Incapacity Benefit
pensions, purchased annuities, interest or royalties arising in the UK
In making this application/claim, you are consenting to the tax authorities of France certifying to HM Revenue & Customs in the UK that
you are resident in France for the purposes of French tax
.

I dont know if this link is of any use to anybody, https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/373916/france-individual.pdf, but it might be of some help in trying to get a repayment from HMR&C

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 Post subject: Re: United Kingdom/France Double Taxation Convention
PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2015 5:52 am 
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Thanks Peake. Have forwarded to several people.

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 Post subject: Re: United Kingdom/France Double Taxation Convention
PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2015 7:15 am 
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I've made this a "sticky" so that it says at the top of the Finance section :)


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 Post subject: Re: United Kingdom/France Double Taxation Convention
PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2015 9:48 am 
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Location: Le Périgord Vert (24)
Not sure how this relates to me, if at all, but, this year for the first time since we each retired, I had a call from the local tax office telling me that I haven't completed the form (2047K) correctly.

This, despite always doing it the same way both online or in person at the office.

On the first page, under 'Pensions, Retraits, Rents' I have totalled both of our UK incomes seperately (mine OAP, company & Pru annuity, hers OAP and local government pension).

Then, under V1 'Revenues imposables de source etrangere etc' I have repeated the figures from the first page, totalled them and, as instructed underneath, reported the total in box 8TK of the blue form 2042K.

Now, after all this time, I get this phone call in which the man tells me I shouldn't fill in V1 or 8TK at all. He did try to explain why but, unfortunately, he, after noting my accent, tried to explain in English (he said he had been practising all afternoon :| ), and he just wasn't up to it.

I have never paid income tax here. When working, in this low employment area on the SMIC, I didn't earn enough (and in fact one year even got a rebate :-\ ) or since, on comparable pension income by now.

I don't remember who told me to do what I have been doing, or why, but it has never been queried before. If it means that I should pay tax after all, then I will accept that as a justifiable fact of life, but what worries me is if they then come after me for more than 12 years of back taxes. :shock:

I realise that many, perhaps most, of you are self employed or have never worked here, but I am interested to know if there is anyone else doing it the way I do, or differently, and the result. :-\

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 Post subject: Re: United Kingdom/France Double Taxation Convention
PostPosted: Mon Jun 29, 2015 2:18 pm 
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I have been double taxed here and in GB for the last 7 years on my pension and on my letting and investments.my French accountant has told me that due to the French government not signing the international agreement I would probably have to go to court in order to get a refund. This Iconsider is not really worth it as at 81 I just do not want that kind of worry.


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 Post subject: Re: United Kingdom/France Double Taxation Convention
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2015 12:31 pm 
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Location: Ardeche
I think you need a new accountant Thomas.

There is a double taxation treaty (DDT) in force between the UK and France and this specifies which pensions are taxed by which country, where letting income is taxed etc.


https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... france.pdf


It is possible that investment income is taxed in both countries, but the tax paid in one is allowed for in the second.


Edited to add: Although income may be taxed in the UK, it still needs to be declared in France and will be used as part of your total income to calculate your French tax liability.

David

My tax adviser - aka the nice helpful lady at the Hotel d'Impots - insists that income taxed outside of France under a DDT is declared on page 4, but not on page 1.
Page 4 data is reported in 8TK, the other incomes declared further up the form as "French" income.

I suggest you go back to your tax office and discuss further, I think there may have been a misunderstanding at your office.

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 Post subject: Re: United Kingdom/France Double Taxation Convention
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2015 1:39 pm 
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Location: Le Périgord Vert (24)
thelastoneout wrote:

David

My tax adviser - aka the nice helpful lady at the Hotel d'Impots - insists that income taxed outside of France under a DDT is declared on page 4, but not on page 1.
Page 4 data is reported in 8TK, the other incomes declared further up the form as "French" income.

I suggest you go back to your tax office and discuss further, I think there may have been a misunderstanding at your office.



Thanks Andy, but, apart from my wife's local authority pension, mine is not taxable in UK. Her pension is not great enough presumably and all of mine, French and British, is payable (and declared as such) here.

I might have a word next time I am in the area though, but for the time being I await the demand. :YMPRAY:

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